The Runemaster Himself?

[qos]

I started reading Taking Up the Runes at lunch yesterday.

Paxson starts out with a conceptual overview of the runes, including what is known or believed about the religious and mundane roots. (I love Pagan authors who make a distinction between what is known and what is speculation!) She then goes on to describe how one makes and/or consecrates a set of runes, and includes a ritual to do to connect with the spiritual roots of the runes before working with them.

You can't talk about runes for very long without talking about Odin, who hung upside down on the World Tree for nine days to win them. As I've mentioned before, the Scandanavian gods have not attracted me until recently, and I've never thought much about Odin. He seemed far more perilous than most, a trickster. . . Not someone I felt drawn to.*

But Paxson made it very clear that if you're going to take runelore seriously, you need to get to know Odin and ask his blessing on your work. So I bent my head, closed my eyes -- yes, in the middle of the kitchen lounge at work, in the midst of people walking by and microwaving their lunches, and talking -- and began to offer a prayer of respectful greeting.



I'd barely begun when I had the sense of Him filling my mind. And he wasn't particularly interested in my words once I'd shaped and started to make good on the intention of addressing him. He was stern, and my primary perception was a sense of So, you're back. There were no actual words from him, no blessing, just a sense that he knew exactly who I was, and what I wanted and we had a history that I can't remember, and he can't exactly blame me for that at this point in time, but I'd better be clear that he has a claim on me that goes way back. And no, he wasn't interested in offering any explanations at the moment.

He wasn't interested in chatting. It was more of an official appearance, like a sovereign on a balcony. He was letting me know that damn straight he's here, and he's paying attention, which means that *I* had better be paying attention too.

I'm still feeling a bit of WTF?
I've never had a divinity come to me with this kind of "your ass is mine" attitude.
I've had divinities be friendly, tender, helpful, mysterious, indifferent.
I've been welcomed after seeking someone out. Isis has been gently pleased by my attention, and there are hints that I was a priestess of Inanna long ago. But neither of them have acted at all possessive. Tiwaz seems to have extended his goodwill to me as a courtesy, given my status with LM. Freyja accepts our offerings and seems to enjoy the worship, but hasn't made any indication that she's interested in a more personal relationship. Arianrhod is still a mystery, even though it's clear that she is a patron of my training.

Do I really have a past with Odin?
Or is he just being a stereotypical if-you're-in-my-territory-you're-mine patriarch?

Was it even really him?
I've had allies pretend to be deities at least twice in the past, teaching me that I can't trust everything I think I perceive on the inner. This could be another case of that situation. In fact, on reflection, the other two times I've been deceived it was with images of deities who were indeed being very possessive and demanding. Except that this wasn't the overwhelming, in-my-face tone of those situations. This being was not interested in getting right up in my face and saying BOO. He was vivid, but reserved. The point wasn't to intimidate me, just make an impression.

I'm feeling a bit nervous about sharing this, lest it sound like I'm merrily out collecting deities for my shelf. It's really not what I'm doing. I certainly wasn't looking for or expecting such a vivid encounter, nor do I feel any interest in 'expanding the roster' of the deities I'm working with. My plate is full enough already. My prayer was intended as a courtesy call, not a desire for a personal relationship.

Oh yes: yesterday was Wednesday. Wotan's day.


*LM shared a few memories of Valhalla with me (more on that when I continue his story). He didn't have many direct dealings with Odin, but described him as "both the wise and loving father you've always wanted and a dirty old man."

Comments

[makhsihed.livejournal.com]

That... actually sounds like Odhinn to me.

Be careful with him, he's not trustworthy by any means. Careful about making any deals with him; he'll take a mile if you give him an inch.

He's very much a lawyer, by my experience. There's good to him, a lot of good; he's not evil or anything - but he's both a lawyer and a judge. He seems to respect being stood up to, though, even if he'll do his best to cut you down if you do so.

(All UPG, per usual.)

[oakmouse]

One of the things I respect about Diana Paxson is that she understands the difference between speculation and actual knowledge.

Re: Odin --- what Makhsihed said. He's jesuitical beyond the wiliest Jesuit in his ability to reinterpret or wiggle out from under agreements. Casuistry-r-us. This is not to say he's evil; he's not, at least in my experience of him; but he's single-minded when it comes to achieving his own purposes, and unlikely to count the cost. In that (although not in other ways), he reminds me much of Wagner's Wotan. However, he's also capable of generosity and magnificence. Trust him? Not readily. Snub him? Don't even think of it.

I also have to agree that what you've experienced of him does sound like the Odin I've met. Geesh. Interesting complication, this. More in email.

[shadowandstar.livejournal.com]

Just when we'd pretty much cleaned up our email backlog. . . ;-)

[bodhibird.livejournal.com]

DLP has a Livejournal: dpaxson. And you may want to get to know my friend lwood, who is one of Diana's students and good friends with That One-Eyed Dude.

[oakmouse]

*looks at older emails in inbox*

We had?

;)

[shadowandstar.livejournal.com]

Thank you!

[shadowandstar.livejournal.com]

I always appreciate your perspective on these posts, makhsihed -- and given your own LJ's focus on Kemet, I hadn't realized your experience was more broad (silly me. . . .).

Please feel free to share more!

[makhsihed.livejournal.com]

he's single-minded when it comes to achieving his own purposes, and unlikely to count the cost.

That's a very good way of phrasing it. I'm gonna have to share that with gaarik (who was silly and went under a year's contract to Odhinn a while back), if that's okay? *grin*

[makhsihed.livejournal.com]

My experience is primarily Kemetic, yes, but I'm a member of ADF to honor my akhu (my ancestors are mostly indo-european). My fiance, gaarik, is primarily Norse in religious practice, so I have a lot of experience by proxy with Freyja, Odhinn, and Loki (but especially Freyja, who he's dedicated to).

My heart-brother/best friend is Vedic, and so through him I have experience with his patron, Kali.

A few friends of mine who I do occasional work with have also helped expand my experience. I've gotten to know the Morrigan over time, and Herne/Cernunnos.

Those are the ones I've had the most experience with, at any rate, outside the Kemetic pantheon.

[oakmouse]

Certainly, share away! And thank you!

[lwood.livejournal.com]

Hi! Just a note to let you know that yes, I'll be writing a summat longer reply. More soon!

-- Lorrie

[shadowandstar.livejournal.com]

Thanks!
I look forward to it!

[lwood.livejournal.com]

I love Pagan authors who make a distinction between what is known and what is speculation!

*grin* Among recons (reconstructionist pagans), this is considered a good trait to cultivate if one would like to be accepted into the politer circles of discourse.

You can't talk about runes for very long without talking about Odin, who hung upside down on the World Tree for nine days to win them.

Well, now--there's some argument on the "upside-down" point. I don't know that there's any basis for hanging upside-down with more provenance than "well, that's what the Hanged Man does on the Tarot card".

Contrariwise, the associations with Odin as a god of the hanged--as in dead--are much stronger, threaded all through the lore. People without much of a miscellaneous pagan background tend to see the ride of Ygg (the Terrible One) on his steed (Yggdrasil) as something akin to a shamanic death and rebirth ordeal--and Odin's numerous associations with death in general, and hanged men in particular, seem to reinforce this reading.

[but heathens, we bicker about everything]
-- Lorrie

[lwood.livejournal.com]

As I've mentioned before, the Scandanavian gods have not attracted me until recently, and I've never thought much about Odin. He seemed far more perilous than most, a trickster. . . Not someone I felt drawn to.*

"Far more perilous than most"--yep, I would agree. "Trickster" carries a lot with it that doesn't necessarily fit. It fits, but only once you start hanging a lot of corollaries on it.

Should you continue to explore this topic, particularly through dpaxson's book as she encourages development along these lines, you may come to find developing relationships with more of the gang.

LM shared a few memories of Valhalla with me (more on that when I continue his story).

Hm. The cited context is an interesting data point, on which I shall wait for more.

He didn't have many direct dealings with Odin, but described him as "both the wise and loving father you've always wanted and a dirty old man."

Yes--to a point. Also many other things. He's not easy to pin down; had you noticed? ;)

But Paxson made it very clear that if you're going to take runelore seriously, you need to get to know Odin and ask his blessing on your work. So I bent my head, closed my eyes -- yes, in the middle of the kitchen lounge at work, in the midst of people walking by and microwaving their lunches, and talking -- and began to offer a prayer of respectful greeting.

And why not there? Anyplace one can shunt aside distractions is a reasonable place to pray/meditate/etc. ;)

I'd barely begun when I had the sense of Him filling my mind.

Good grief, he's a Pushy Bastard--this is not on the list of ninety zillion by-names he has scattered through the lore...but it oughtta be.

(continued)

-- Lorrie

[lwood.livejournal.com]

And he wasn't particularly interested in my words once I'd shaped and started to make good on the intention of addressing him. He was stern, and my primary perception was a sense of So, you're back. There were no actual words from him, no blessing, just a sense that he knew exactly who I was, and what I wanted and we had a history that I can't remember, and he can't exactly blame me for that at this point in time, but I'd better be clear that he has a claim on me that goes way back. And no, he wasn't interested in offering any explanations at the moment.

Hm--fascinating. Not out-of-character, but not what I'd call typical for a first time, either.

He was letting me know that damn straight he's here, and he's paying attention, which means that *I* had better be paying attention too.

I'm still feeling a bit of WTF?
I've never had a divinity come to me with this kind of "your ass is mine" attitude.
I've had divinities be friendly, tender, helpful, mysterious, indifferent.

It may simply have been to make an impression, or to jar you from complacency--without knowing more about you, I can't say for sure.

Do I really have a past with Odin?
Or is he just being a stereotypical if-you're-in-my-territory-you're-mine patriarch?

Well, now, in my experience...he'll insinuate and imply a lot, while outright stating very little. Don't be so sure you're hearing quite what he's saying until you get to know him better.

That said...if you know to trust him to be himself, it can be a very rewarding relationship.

Was it even really him?
I've had allies pretend to be deities at least twice in the past, teaching me that I can't trust everything I think I perceive on the inner.

Excellent! Good that you've noticed that yes, other wights (spirits) can play silly buggers and pretend to be OZ THE GREAT AND TERRIBLE until you think to look behind the curtain.

Still, as a rule, I have found it wise to take statements at face value until given good reason to believe otherwise. Should this entity do Odinish things, and continue to behave in an Odin-like fashion, one may as well proceed on that basis until proven otherwise.

He was vivid, but reserved. The point wasn't to intimidate me, just make an impression.

Well, you had been knocking--first by seeking the runes, which are decidedly his art, and then by actually looking him up.

Also, I think, to size you up and see how you would respond.

I'm feeling a bit nervous about sharing this, lest it sound like I'm merrily out collecting deities for my shelf. It's really not what I'm doing. I certainly wasn't looking for or expecting such a vivid encounter, nor do I feel any interest in 'expanding the roster' of the deities I'm working with. My plate is full enough already. My prayer was intended as a courtesy call, not a desire for a personal relationship.

I'm going to presume that you're not out looking for merit badges, then--Odin really is a pushy enough bastard all by his own self to have merited everything you've said without much apparent impetus from you--and more.

You're not wrong yet by my lights; keep it up. ;)

-- Lorrie

[lwood.livejournal.com]

Oh yes: yesterday was Wednesday. Wotan's day.

Funny sidebar: that association only came about because when the Roman Empire came to England, dammit they wanted weeks, and days whereof--before then, there's no real evidence that the locals reckoned time in anything much shorter than "a season". With the particular Roman passion for pigeonholing, they rammed the local gods into cubbies that would correspond with theirs, given a certain point of view.

The system that the Romans nicked from the Greeks went: Saturn, Sun, Moon, Mars, Mercury, Jupiter, and Venus. It was, however, astrological when they used it--but when it got transferred to Anglo-Saxon England, most of the names got translated to reflect the ruling deities of the associated heavenly bodies as they had been syncretized by the Romans.

Except for some reason, Saturn kept Saturday.

And Woden for Mercury is...rather a stretch.

...aaaaaand the German gods thus cited aren't responsible for the corresponding heavenly bodies once one deals with cultural context (Tyr doesn't get Jupiter--if anything, it's the North Star).

Those damed Romans, forever banging their square pegs into round holes...

Anyway! The historical precedent is rather late, is my point. This doesn't stop any of them from claiming it anyway, nor from it being a useful correspondence just now--I just like to ramble.

-- Lorrie

[shadowandstar.livejournal.com]

I appreciate your extensive responses, Lorrie! I may not be able to reply to all at once, but I'll give it a try.

a good trait to cultivate
I have an MA in Comparative Religion, and entered the program specifically because I didn't trust the mutual cross-references in the popular pagan press on the subject of sacred prostitution. So I went and studied with professors who had studied the Ancient Near East and wrote a thesis on what I believed the ancient texts did and did not actually say -- and what the archetype means to some (can never claim 'all'!) modern women: both those who claim the title and those who find it inspiring for their own journey to reconcile the sacred and the sexual.

And in that light, I appreciate you pointing out that the image of Odin upside-down is not supported by the lore. Given my background, I'm a bit embarrassed for having made that kind of assumption.

One reason I'm trying to be cautious in this area is that I don't have the background.

My own personal talents lean toward the shamanic, the walker-between-worlds, which might be another reason, besides the runes, for Him to introduce himself the way he did.

[shadowandstar.livejournal.com]

The cited context is an interesting data point, on which I shall wait for more.

Definitely not a citation to accept without question, especially when we don't know each other.

[shadowandstar.livejournal.com]

but not what I'd call typical for a first time, either.

Can you describe what could be called "typical"?

Don't be so sure you're hearing quite what he's saying until you get to know him better.

Good advice. Thanks.

pretend to be OZ THE GREAT AND TERRIBLE until you think to look behind the curtain.

*grin
That was the same analogy I used when I was processing the experiences.

Should this entity do Odinish things, and continue to behave in an Odin-like fashion, one may as well proceed on that basis until proven otherwise.

Which is one of my reasons for sharing here. I don't know what "Odin-like" consists of.

Thanks again!

[lwood.livejournal.com]

I have an MA in Comparative Religion, and entered the program specifically because I didn't trust the mutual cross-references in the popular pagan press on the subject of sacred prostitution. So I went and studied with professors who had studied the Ancient Near East and wrote a thesis on what I believed the ancient texts did and did not actually say -- and what the archetype means to some (can never claim 'all'!) modern women: both those who claim the title and those who find it inspiring for their own journey to reconcile the sacred and the sexual.

Ooo! Fascinating!

Can you summarize it in a few paragraphs for the interested, reasonably educated laywoman--by which I mean me?

And in that light, I appreciate you pointing out that the image of Odin upside-down is not supported by the lore. Given my background, I'm a bit embarrassed for having made that kind of assumption.

Don't be--it's quite common. I tend to hold that no, he really really died, and then really had to work his way back in shamanistic fashion.

One reason I'm trying to be cautious in this area is that I don't have the background.

At the expense of plugging my best friend's magnum opus, I would agree that yes, Taking Up the Runes is a good place to start--as is her more recent Essential Ásatrú.

My own personal talents lean toward the shamanic, the walker-between-worlds, which might be another reason, besides the runes, for Him to introduce himself the way he did.

*snork* Yes, yes it would. ;)

-- Lorrie

[lwood.livejournal.com]

Can you describe what could be called "typical"?

*sigh* Not...readily.

Which sounds like a horrid cop-out.

Which is one of my reasons for sharing here. I don't know what "Odin-like" consists of.

To throw down some fannish allusions:
Gandalf--both the Grey and the White, capable of slumming as a tour guide to dwarves and throwing down with Balrogs.
Dumbledore--including and especially the seventh book, when you see just how deep-laid the plan was from the start.
Obi-Wan Kenobi--especially in A New Hope

He's the old man in every corner, the old general one step ahead of his enemies, the one with his eye on the main chance, sacrificing anything and everything for that goal.

He is the mad whirl of thought, the fury of inspiration.

He is rune-winner, tree-rider, woe-worker, ferryman, desired one, far-crier, and wished for.

His thirst is for knowledge, his quest never-ending.

He may chase a skirt, but will drop it at once for new knowledge--and will chase a woman with new knowledge beyond the ends of things.

...yet he always returns to his Beloved, with her Ladies, and her home in the saltmarshes by the sea.

He is inconstant--to all but himself.

He asks nothing of his people that he would not ask of himself, but as he already hanged himself and caused the death of his favorite son, this is small comfort.

He loves as fiercely as he does anything else: while he can take no bullet for you, he can take them with you, and show you how to learn from it.

I...am completely besotted with him, but I know him enough to know what he will spring on the unwary.

Even for the wary...there are no tame wolves.

Clear as mud?

-- Lorrie

[shadowandstar.livejournal.com]

I appreciate the affirmation!

My work with the runes didn't get past the first week or so, and he hasn't come around since -- not that I've recognized anyway.

Not sure what it all means. Perhaps if I'd stuck with the runes he and I would have gotten better acquainted -- again. . . Or maybe he'll show up again in the future.

[ancareth-raven.livejournal.com]

Ha, I enjoyed this tremendously! Both the account of your experiences and the many comments here. Then, I sort of just drifted to the energy awareness to the left of me, near my altar, where I felt ancient Norse gods once come to me when I was making a dragon rune amulet for someone, and I just recalled that briefly and felt like some presence was reappearing, because of reading through all the text in this post... and my body jerked as if confirming I slipped into something for a moment there...